The Gaming Den

What's with the tradition of lawyers referring other lawyers as "esquire" and "my learned colleague"?

Also, what is the origin of lawyers filing suit attaching a dollar bill to the notice of the law suit?

Game On,
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Well, the esquire thing is a title that comes from English courts for a commoner that has risen to noble status. It's an old honorific we inherited with the rest of English common law that denotes a barrister (courtroom lawyer) from a soliciter (non-court lawyer). Soliciters are called "Gentlemen."

"My learned colleague" comes from the fact that the law degree is a Juris Doctor. Again, just an honorific.

The dollar bill thing has me stumped. If I were to take a stab at it, it'd give the lawyer some protection under the law if the notice gets tampered with since you can then show damages, but it could easily be another pointless custom.

Accordingly to Wiki, esquire doesn't really mean much on it's own, hence why it's used, because it's an honorific with no inherent meaning, but will be taken into account if someone's being looked at for misrepresentation as a legal professional. You can use it, and no one will say boo, because it doesn't mean much, kind of like "Mr," just more prestigious. But if you're already on your ass for representing yourself as a fully accredited legal professional, using "esquire" after your name will be treated as part of your fraudulent efforts.

K, how would you rank the various hierarchy of lawyers in terms of pay and prestige? For example: civil lawyers, criminal lawyers, patent attorneys, law school professors with a PhD, etc..

Related: The term "attorney" supposedly dates back to the days of Trial by Combat, when you could hire someone to take your place to decide the issue.

Ancient History wrote:Related: The term "attorney" supposedly dates back to the days of Trial by Combat, when you could hire someone to take your place to decide the issue.

Even today, you can grant power of attorney to someone, who then acts in your stead on a matter. An important detail in things like living wills. The amount of training as a lawyer this requires is not at all, so you can conceivably give power of attorney to your spouse, children, orrr just about anyone.

Lago PARANOIA wrote:K, how would you rank the various hierarchy of lawyers in terms of pay and prestige? For example: civil lawyers, criminal lawyers, patent attorneys, law school professors with a PhD, etc..

In terms of pay, it really doesn't matter what you do: be a managing partner at a major firm and you make bank.

Beyond that, it varies wildly. Personal injury guys tend to be the most swingy since they take a third of what they win, so they might be the highest grossing or the lowest. Everyone else tends to stick to a scale based on experience and firm size with guys who bring in clients getting a commission at firms (but private practice guys make money off clients as well).

Some people leave law school and are unable to find work or only work for 30K a year, and some few leave the top ten schools and make 150K a year. The pay for a lawyer is much like any small business owner.

Criminal defense or working for a government tends to be the lowest paid for different reasons, mostly because it's one step above being unemployed.

As for prestige, Constitutional Law lawyers tend to have the most prestige among lawyers, but if you didn't attend Harvard in the 1970s then you aren't a Constitutional Law lawyer. Mostly lawyers are constantly defending their school and chosen specialty and ragging on others, so there really isn't a consensus on what is "the most prestigious." A better school and more money count more than chosen field.

Out in the world, people can't tell what kind of lawyer you are and won't understand if you explained it, so you generally get the same reception everywhere. Being rich tends to be the deciding factor.

K wrote:The dollar bill thing has me stumped. If I were to take a stab at it, it'd give the lawyer some protection under the law if the notice gets tampered with since you can then show damages, but it could easily be another pointless custom.

My guess would be that it has to do with assigning a specific value to it, and that could be the reason.

I had a similar thing happen to me at my last job. I wrote software for them, and when I started, I had to sign a set of things, such as an NDA and something saying that they own anything I develop. Still, I guess actual patent law works a bit differently, so I have to somehow be compensated for that (I don't know the specifics). One day, my boss was filing a patent for something I helped develop, and I had to sign a couple documents, one of which was witnessed by someone else, and I got a dollar as compensation for my efforts. I also seem to remember witnessing a coworker getting a dollar once, too.

[/not a lawyer]